Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strings.

Is your zither in need of repair? Do you have questions on how to best maintain your zither, or have advice? Post your questions and advice here.

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JRCOLS
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Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strings.

Post by JRCOLS »

I replaced a Begleit f-3 string with a nylon guitar e-1 string, with good results . Once it tuned, I marked it with a, red, indelible ink felt tip, except in the place where my finger touches it. I recommend a good brand such as D'Addario, set,Model # EJ46C "Pro Arte Composites," which is high tension.

I took down the diameters of Lenzner Soloklang strings, in Munich tuning using a digital read-out calipers, in 100ths of an inch and compared to the string sizes in the Pro Arte package. The comparisons are as follows:

Guitar: e-1: .0285 in., b-2: .0327, g-3: .040, D-4: .029, A-5: .036 and E-6: .046 inches.

Zither: Fretboard diameters : a1/a2: .014, d: .019, G: .035 and C: .050 inches.

Begleit: es-1: .032, b-2: .0375, f-3: .032, c-4: .030, g-5: .032, d-6: .0315, a-7: .034, e-8: .033, h-9: .034,
fis-10: .038, cis-11: .031 and gis-12: .042 inches.

Bass: Es-13: .058, B-14: .0395, F-15: .050, C-16: .039, G-17: .043, D-18: .039, A-19: .052, E-20: .039,
H-21: .039, Fis-22: .043, Cis-23: .040, Gis-24: .047 inches (H: B-Natural; B: B-Flat).

Kontra Bass: F-25: .065, E-26: .060, Es-27: .069, D-28: .068, Cis-29: .071 and C-30: .064 inches.

I have not tried any of these replacements; but I hope the above measurements will be of help.
Rudy Mueller
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by Rudy Mueller »

In addition to diameter, is weight per unit length a consideration? in addition to any resultant tension differences? There are some pretty good guitar string calculators out there on the web.

Some local pro's change strings on an almost quarterly basis. Mine seem to last for years.

Rudi
NutmegCT
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by NutmegCT »

Just my "new guy" thoughts, but there are many materials, as well as sizes, of instrument strings. Iron, red brass, yellow brass, nylon, etc. Plus plain and "wound". Different materials, different densities.

Wouldn't replacing a metal string with a nylon string change the "timbre" tone quality of the note? Seems nylon would be softer and more "mellow" than a metal string.

I'm just learning about all this as I work on restoring an old clavichord.

My two cents.
Tom in CT
kenbloom
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by kenbloom »

Where as guitar strings are a simple matter of diameter and length, zither strings are different. The fingerboard strings are similar to guitar strings but the size of the core is smaller and the size of the winding is a bit larger. This yields a string of lower tension but similar diameter. Zithers are very low tension instruments, especially the harfenzithers.
The bass, accompaniment, and contra bass strings are very different from guitar strings although similar to the wound nylon guitar strings. They mostly have filaments of nylon wrapped with silver-plated copper or some sort of plastic winding. In general, any stringed instrument will sound better and last longer using the lowest tension strings that give you good solid tone. I have seen many good zithers ripped apart because they had the wrong strings on them.
Mono-filament nylon may work reasonably well for some of the higher pitched accompaniment strings but the tension will be higher than the designated string from say a Bergfe Green label set.
In an emergency I have used guitar strings for my fingerboard but they never sounded very good and I soon replaced them. I save old zither strings for emrgency situations and that has worked well for me over the years. YMMV.

Ken Bloom
NutmegCT
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by NutmegCT »

I'm glad this topic is active. My own Schuster zither arrived with fingerboard strings as follows:

A - single strand steel
A - single strand steel
D - single strand steel
G - wound (brass?) over steel
C - wound (brass?) over filament (silk?)

When tuned to pitch, those very thin A A D strings are "tight" and hard to push down at the frets - thus my left hand fingers get sore, inflamed, then bleed.

What fingerboard strings are available, and what are recommended? I'm hoping to find fingerboard strings which are "softer" to my fingers.

Thanks.
Tom in CT
kenbloom
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by kenbloom »

Hi Tom,

For your fingerboard strings there are a number of possibilities. The A strings are just plain steel. Standard is around .014". You can go to any guitar shop and get a couple of .012" plain steel strings and give those a try for the A. For D, the standard zither string is either a plain phosphor bronze wire or a thin wound string. I would try a Bergfe Green label wound D first and see how that works for you. I love the sound of the plain phosphor bronze wire but they do break more often than the wound strings. Hope this helps.

Ken Bloom
NutmegCT
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by NutmegCT »

Thanks very much for the suggestions.

As a follow up - is there a chart or guide to the wire size and material for each of the strings? My Schuster came with about two dozen strings - mostly wound - all coiled up, and of course not labeled as to where they should be placed.

Tom in CT
bcolclough
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by bcolclough »

I am in the same position. I have several wound strings in my case that came with the zither but I have no idea what gauges are for what note. Any direction on this would be great for when I need to change strings.
DonO
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Re: Possible String Replacements With Classical Guitar Strin

Post by DonO »

My advice on strings of which you have no idea or clue as to what they are: "when in doubt, throw them out". In the long run you will find it cheaper to purchase the right string(s) for your instrument. Most Zithers out there today are wonderful old antique instruments still with a lot of life in them if they are treated with love and care. I have gotten my replacement zither strings direct from Germany from two different sources: www.SchneiderMusik.com and from Andreas Waldschuetz of www.Der-Geigenmacher.de. I like Pyramid strings for the Alto and Concert Zithers I have. You can get Bergfee, Lenzner or Pyramid from SchneiderMusik; choose as your heart or wallet dictate. There are a couple of others in the US who are vending strings from Germany. I think it is foolishness/suicide to be attempting to slide in guitar strings for zither strings and hoping for the same sounds. However, if you want to install strings on the cheap, then guitar strings or 20-pound-test fishing line is your answer. VIELE GLUECK!
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